We All Go Through Seasons in Life With Tricia Halsey

Hello, beautiful lady and gentlemen! If you are a perfectionist people, pleaser, high-performer, have a tendency to overwork, struggle with time and often feel like you’re pushing a truck up the hill, this is definitely the episode for you.

First and foremost, I want to be here to remind you. You are not alone. You are in great company. I am definitely a recovering everything except for athlete. And so is my guest today, Miss Tricia Halsey. She is well, first of all, she’s amazing. I adore this woman. She is motivated by seeing people, schools and companies flourish.

Tricia is a mom, wife and entrepreneur who integrates systems level insight with bigger than life vision. She’s a true visionary to get results and see people elevated to become who they already are. That’s really important for the lens of this conversation, to help people to become who they already are.

She is the thought leader of Generous Leadership, which is a leadership paradigm and method that unleashes human potential. She is also the founder of Big Idea Project, a nonprofit co-curricular partner in the education system. Tricia has found a way to literally integrate her leadership development methods to change school as usual. And she’s doing that right now, as fast as she can. She is also the designer of the Generous Leadership Challenge, which we are focusing on in this interview, which is an experiential movement designed for businesses, families, and others to use her model of intentional doing for transformation.

I cannot say enough about this interview. This might be the pivotal interview of the show because it speaks to really the underlayers the foundation of what I believe and why I’m having these conversations with leaders like Tricia and the other amazing women on the show. So this is another one of those grab your favorite beverage, get in your comfort clothes and find a chair and blanket and pillow so that you do not need to push pause.

Of course, I have my 2 cents. It’s really, actually not my 2 cents. It’s my opportunity to get you set up and ready for some of those golden nuggets that that often can just pass you by. But I have the unique lens of having not only done the interview, but listened to it several times. And one of my favorite things to do is to weave things together. You know, I’m a master at puzzles. I actually do puzzles in record time, just to side note, but let me get back to a couple things that I really think will be powerful for you as you’re listening to my conversation with Tricia. First and foremost, if you’ve ever struggled with symptoms of striving, you know, that feeling, you know, Tricia calls pushing a truck up a hill. I just say, push, push, push. And I think we all have at different times because as Tricia shares, you know, there’s different seasons to life.

And sometimes, you’re kicking into that, what she calls striving. But what I love is we at a couple of different points in the calmer stations, talk about the symptoms of this, how to identify it in ourselves, because I believe it is different for everyone and knowing what those symptoms are for you, that could be the most powerful takeaway of this interview. So, listen for what Tricia shares are her symptoms. And then she turns it around on me and says, well, how does it show up for you? So I share that later in the interview, and I do believe that first and foremost, before we can make a change or see a shift within ourselves, we have to be able to identify. And so one of the most powerful takeaways for anyone listening will be to understand your own symptoms of striving.

There’s also a conversation around the importance of reflection time, not just for you as a leader, but to incorporate that with your teams. And one of the things I really, really love is we talk about accountability. We talk about having people in your life who will be truth tellers and not just a friend or a colleague who will tell you what you want to hear, but somebody who will really call you out. I love, love, love that part of the conversation. Of course, we get up to everything generous leadership and the framework that Tricia has developed. And of course, before we wrap up today, I will let you know how to engage with that. Plus there’s one more thing I want to tease out for you. But I’m going to wait until after you listen to the interview. So, without further delay, let’s get started.

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Are you high achiever? Would you define yourself as a high achiever?

Oh my goodness. Yes. A perfectionist, yes. For sure.

Okay. So, so it’s in your DNA, you know, I feel like you just kind of somewhere show up and it’s just there, whether we plan for it or not. So when was the first moment you realized, Hey, this push, push push more and more and more might not be a good idea.

My whole life. I was an addict plead, actually growing up and a swimmer. And so it was the thing you got to push yourself. It’s how much pain can you endure in swimming and then this, you know, a straight A student and I just was always constantly achieving and, you know, clubs, whatever. And then going into my professional career, it was constantly, what can I achieve? What can I do? Who do I want to be? Or who do I want others to see me to be? And this stress started to build up and stress is just a killer. And, after helping two entrepreneurs build their companies, as the COO, I moved in and said, I want to build my own. I want to create my own.

And it was in that process of building a business from scratch in a really difficult space in the education space that doesn’t like a lot of change and I’m a change maker and I’m a bit of a reformer. It’s just who I am. It’s in me. So, I’m pushing and people are saying it can’t be done. And I’m saying, no, no, it can, it can be done. And, my board is saying, do you need help? No, I don’t need any help. I’ve got this, you know, we got this, we’re going to just build it. And, after about five years, and I think it was a lifetime of accumulating, but five years in that entrepreneur’s spot in that seat that I started to get very, very, very sick. To the point where doctors couldn’t diagnose me, they didn’t know what was going on. I was getting a new symptom, health symptom, every mental and physical health, every single week, something new would pop up, whether it was fibromyalgia symptoms or night terrors or just lots and lots of cancer symptoms. I mean, it was ridiculous.

And I was at the point where I was like, I’m just going to check out. This is where I felt like I was dying. And, it was at that point where we received an invitation to go sabbatical in Israel and we sold our house and moved our family for a summer to a foreign country that we have never been to before and engaged in a sabbatical that saved my life.

So, now I’m pretty vigilant about striving. I call it striving, overworking, proving yourself through your work, making it’s the feeling of pushing a truck up a hill. That’s how I know I’m walking into it. Is that feeling in my chest, that, and I get kind of blinders on, you know, and I’m just going to do it cause I’m super stubborn and determined.

And so, yeah, by the way you’re describing me perfectly.

Yeah. So I stay away when I start to feel that feeling come on. I try to run as fast as I can. Sometimes I’ll have dreams. I’m starting to move into that season right now, another season where there’s going to be a lot of demands on my time and my creation it’s it takes space to create and design and to create and design in such a rapid rate and produce high quality is it’s just really stressful.

And, just two nights ago, I had a dream of this red brick wall just dropped. And I heard this voice say stop. And I knew when I woke up, I brought this to my team and I was like, I am going into some bad territory again. And we need to rethink this. There’s another way. There’s a third way here. And so, we brainstormed together and found a new way.

Okay. So, what you just shared, there’s a lot in there to unpack for the woman or man out there who is struggling with this because we, a lot of us do this yourselves. I’ll just put out there that at one point, my doctor said, I think you have lupus. You need to quit your job and change your life. Well, I don’t have lupus, but I had a lot of stress. Right. Yeah. And it affects your health.

So was it the sabbatical that moved you into changing your ways or creating the space? Like sometimes we have to put it on ourselves. We have to have a crisis. There needs to be a dramatic change. And I see you nodding. Yes. So that is what shifted you, allowed you. Cause it was so different to move your entire family and to a completely different country. It sounds like you’d never been to before.

Yes, we had, we knew like one person, they’re the one who made the invitation and he wasn’t interested in hosting us. So, it was more like you should come consider coming here, but I don’t have a place for you to say, I’m not going to give you any money to afford a really, it’s a very expensive country to live in. And so we just took a chance and started throwing out some lines and asking for rentals and we just moved. And I think for me, it was that disruption that I needed. If I hadn’t, I would have done things, but the little things weren’t going to save me.

Yeah. I just want to really call this moment out because I’ve heard a lot of women, but I know men too, but I just tend to talk to more women, you know, pushing themselves like this and waiting for that disruption. Even to the point for myself where I’ve watched the pattern repeat itself several times.

But all the way to the other side of it, which is where you kind of, were ending that segment of your story where now you’re having the stream, it’s reminding you, you’re waking up the next day coming to your team saying, we need to make some shifts in there. There’s another way.

So how does one get, you know what I’m saying? Like how does one get to that place? Because at the end it’s like, you’re really showing up in true, true form of self-leadership, right? Knowing you have a choice taking ownership, et cetera

I suppose it starts with recalibrating your values. If I hadn’t, if in that moment changed the order of what I value and what I want to pursue in life and who I want to be, then I would have no amount of self-awareness would have prevented me from going back to the way things were. So, I changed my values, like where I wanted to be, where I was going. And then I also grew an awareness. So that combination now, when I’m aware of that, and for everybody it’s different. For me, it’s a tight chest. I’m having a hard time breathing, ruminating thoughts. My shoulders get really tight. My jaw will clench.

So, I know some of the symptoms and then of course, the dreams and things like that. And I’m like, man, I am going into really dangerous territory. And am I willing? And you ask yourself that question, am I willing to do that again? And for me unequivocally, no, every single time, no, I am better for not being in that space. And so I’ve actually trained and spoken with my team about this over and over. And then no one is allowed to live in what I call striving. No one. And if I see it in someone, I’ll call it out.

It doesn’t mean that we don’t work hard. We work really hard, striving the opposite of it is rest. So how do you remain in a state of rest and rest isn’t laziness or not doing something rest is a state of your mind and a state of your heart. And, you can tell when somebody who’s at rest enters the room and I can tell when my team members are just riddled with anxiety or trying to solve a problem, that’s not really meant to be solved at this point. And I think it takes a tremendous amount of courage for a leader because it means letting go of control a little bit and trusting that things will work out. And what we have built together, is meant for all of us, you know, to contribute together. We’re all in this together and it’s not mine to control and it’s that release.

And when that release happens, man, beautiful things happen and I’m healthier and happier. My family is healthier and happier. I’m a better leader there, their better for working with me, you know? So why would we ever shoot the other way? I don’t know. It seems kind of obvious to me. Well

Well, it’s obvious now, but why, what is your hypothesis on that? Why do we choose the other way?

I think we’re probably busy trying to prove or someone to others. Or we can do something, you know, it’s the being and doing peace. And, I guess it’s also linked to this. I think a lot of perfectionists have this people pleasing in them and you have to kill it. It has to die. There has to be a death. I think even in, you know, farming, there’s a death before there’s a rebirth.

We see it, winter comes before spring. So, it’s all over in nature and it’s true for us, too. That there has to be a death before there’s a rebirth, which is kind of what I was alluding to of the new values. There had to be a definitive end to something before I could walk into a new thing. And, I think perhaps some leaders who want to get into this place of rest or struggle with this, they haven’t it die or they haven’t walked it’s into the hard times. And I mean, sometimes the hard struggle is scary. And so then we’ll just stay on the periphery. But what does it mean to really walk into it and know that knowing that something will die? That’s scary, but it’s where life is eventually.

Because we do, I mean, as a culture, we fear death. So, it would make a lot of sense that would be afraid to go into the place where part of us has to die essentially die is what you’re saying.

Yes. And that, for me, that was the trip to Israel and you know, what died is I went to my board and I said, I’m just going to put my hands in the air. I’m going to trust that the organization. And it was the only, I was, it was a new organization. So I was the only one running it. And so that was what was dying, was my control. I was like, I’ve got to step away and I’m going to believe that everybody’s going to be okay when I get back. And if they’re not, we’ll work it out, but I’m going to let go.

I mean, it wasn’t without wisdom. I put some checks and balances in place, but I kind of put everybody on a sabbatical when I left. And so that was what died because when I first went to Israel, I was always thinking what’s going on over there? What am I missing? Oh, no. Cause it was the summer. And it was the prep for the school year for the education season, you know? And so, Oh no, what’s going to happen when everything opens back up and we’re not ready, I haven’t closed the sales, you know, and all of that had to die for the sake of my health and my future and my family. And that was scary. We sold our home for goodness sakes, so we left.

So, for you, cause it might be a little bit different for others, but for you, it was the disruption. And then the releasing of control would be the next piece that took place.

And then not caring what people thought of me.

And then that recap led to the recalibration of values. And then growth in awareness. Yeah. Because once you can start slowing all that down right into the rest phase there’s space, there’s now space. I was talking about this on a previous episode about speed versus space. But, and I think it’s really similar, but now that you’ve created the space, the awareness can come in. Like when you’re in that push, you can not be aware of anything. You’re not aware of anything, let alone yourself. That’s why I think we get into a state of disease.

Yes. I’ve heard that word before, too. I love it. Yeah. It’s yeah. I think for people who are struggling with it right now, I think you just have to, perhaps it’s the slowing down on their reflection. I’ve seen business studies of, you know, if you incorporate reflection, I think its productivity increases by 20% among your team. Just to, for like 15 minutes. At the end of the day, I do, we do ton of reflection on our team. And as a leader, if you’re not taking the time to sit back and reflect and slow down, I think the Mindstorm is what I call it. It’s these thoughts that are just hitting us. And our brain is just going in this mind storm that we’re in. Our thoughts move a whole lot faster, then our heart.

And, I think that if we’re constantly in our heads and we’re not slimming down one, the thoughts aren’t making any sense and you’re getting pummeled, but two, you’re not connecting to your heart. You’re not connecting. And by heart, I mean more than emotions, it’s almost like a soul level where it’s like, Oh, who am I, why am I here? What do I really want to accomplish? And in that reflection, it’s who do I want to be five years from now, 10 years from now, what do I want to be doing?

And if it’s the current path is not going to take me there, then it’s completely inauthentic and a waste of my time, which takes courage then to stop it. And it might mean that everything unravels like current clients go away. Cause they’re mad at you for not doing certain things or your pipeline dries up or even your business ends.

But again, death to life, what happens on the other side of that is you’re an entirely different person who can build a better business and a better team and get better clients.

Renee Brown talks a lot about being brave. I think it’s just that finding it in you. To be brave to reach for the thing that you’re not yet, but you know, it’s in you, you know, we all have that seed of potential in us and it’s not fully unleashed. It’s not fully out. And if you recognize it in you, you know what you’ve got and who you want to be and who the world needs you to be. Why would you not set a path and make the soil fertile, you know, so that it can grow.

It’s kind of like a little tap on the shoulder at first, the heart, the angst, wanting to be connected. And if you don’t listen, it gets to be this knock. I feel like, and that not just gets louder and louder until it’s maybe a crisis of some sort or disruption.

Yeah. Yeah. And it never stops. I mean, you won’t, you don’t like overcome it and then your life is great after that. They keep coming over saying that.

So, it’s a forever journey. So, you’re not all aware now and everything’s perfect and easy, right?

No, no. But the dreams are helpful. What is it? What is it for you? I mean, when you have that feeling where you need to pause?

When I start making, there’s a few different things, one I will not be sleeping as well. All the sudden I’ll be up in the early morning and I won’t be able to go back to sleep. So, that’s cause of my mind is processing so much while I’m sleeping. So that’s one symptom. Another symptom, and these can be separate or all at the same time, you know, just not being able to get a lot done, but having more than enough time, so the productivity goes down dramatically.

And usually with that, for sure, feeling like I’m not accomplishing anything. And so whatever is showing up for me, I just actually do the opposite of what I used to do. I used to power through, I used to work more hours. All-nighters. History shows me that that does not work. It’s like the work is insatiable when I use that strategy. So, I actually do the opposite and create more space.

I was just in a bout of this actually. So, I’ve got Thursdays and Fridays blocked on my calendar now off completely just for the month of July, because I’m like, I need space. I need space and go figure, I’m getting just as much, I’m going to be able to get just as much done. I’m so much more focused. I mean, it’s in less stress. It’s just miraculous. It’s miraculous. But it sounds so simple, but it’s in the simplicity. That can be so challenging for people sometimes, I think.

Yeah. Well I think that’s that Mindstorm, too. We overthink things.

Because if it’s not hard, then it wasn’t worth it. Right. I don’t know. I don’t know.

No, I agree. And the people who are out, you know, providing simple wisdom are the ones that we consider the most profound, everyone’s listening to and inspired by. It’s just a simple reminder. That’s what it means to be human again. And, to be in connection and relationship with one another and that work doesn’t define us work is the outpouring of who we are. It ought to be simple, you know, darn it. Why do we gotta make it so hard?

So we can learn and grow. One of the things that you’re saying as well is that is the power in being who you are like. So, I want to talk about that a little bit more because as you can recalibrate your values, grow in your awareness, what you’re really saying, Tricia, is that you’re now showing up more fully as you. And that’s working. Yes.

It’s awesome. It’s so it’s like living in freedom. I think I was always one of the stressors, the causes of stress. I’ll go back to what people think of me or, you know, the people pleasing walking into a room or a meeting and just being so concerned with what what’s going through their heads at that moment about me and how I’m presenting or whatever. And that was the old me. And now when I sit and I reflect and I practice empathy of just, for instance, if I’m going into a room with, I know is going to be a difficult conversation, I have a lot of those because of the space that I am in and people not wanting to change and always leaning on politics.

And I go into a room that I know is going to be difficult and I know there’s somebody who’s unhappy. And I am going to be the one who represents everything that they hate. And that moment, even though I have done nothing that deserves that, before I would freak out and I’d be like, okay. And I would learn how to, okay, I’m going to justify like, these are my reasons why, and I practiced this empathy beforehand of just, okay, what does it feel like to be in their shoes right now? And why would they be defensive? Oh, it’s probably because they’re hurting and why are they hurting? And, who’s around them really helping them do they feel like they’re alone? And I kind of just imagine being in their shoes and, and I find that love starts to grow for them.

And I let, so then I walk into the room and I let love lead and I bring love into the room and they can sense it. I am now just there and my job is to love them. And I remember one difficult conversation. I just, I knew it was coming. I called the elephant out and then I let it go and I just, I wanted her to vent. And so she vented did a whole bunch of blaming, probably like 15 minutes, you know and just let it go. And then afterwards I looked at her and I said, I love you. You know, that we’re for you. And everything that we stand for is to serve you and to make sure that you and the leaders around you and your teachers succeed and you thrive. And, we will do everything we can to elevate you to be heroes.

And so I’m telling her all this stuff and I actually will get, my eyes will get weepy because it’s not inauthentic. It’s real. And you can feel, I even saw it, your shoulders kind of like the weight just came off and she knew I was for her. And there was nothing that I needed to pretend to be or do. It was just, I know who I am. I love you. And I know what I can do for you and how we can help you and serve you. And, it wasn’t even about that before I see you. And I see the potential in you and you know, a lot of people would walk into situations like that and just see hardness and maybe even not the pain, the defense and the hardness. But I see, like if I remove the pain and I remove the lack of resources and the scarcity and all this, like what could they be?

And so this ability to be who I am and to walk in this and rest in this freedom and to let love lead, it ends up stripping all of the bad stuff from others around me and invites them into the same space that I’m in. It’s a beautiful thing. And it’s not a forced, it’s not a style of leadership. You can’t go, gosh, like take on certain actions to do this. It has to be authentic. And from a place of who you are and going back to our conversation, it must be formed in challenge. Cause the only way we become better people is through refining. Fire is through challenge. We have to step into it and embrace it and then we become better so that others can become better. That’s my leadership philosophy and I’ve seen it work over and over again.

And I’m telling you, there is no other way for me. This is it for the rest of my life. Like I’m going to let love lead and I’m going to be in freedom and I’m gonna do rest. And we’re going to produce amazing, amazing things together, watching other people be unleashed. And so then my team is feeling free, watching me and teachers and stakeholders and watching us, they know that there’s something different and we’ve been able to accomplish what no one else has been able to do breaking into a system.

That’s pretty impenetrable in the way that we have, not as an extra thing, but as a partner, Oh my gosh. They go in and I say, we are not your vendor. We are not transactional. We are a partner. And I don’t know if anybody in the education world really treats anybody like a partner, cause they don’t think anyone’s really for them. And that has shifted everything. And finally they trust us. And they know that we are always for them. Yeah. So that’s just an example.

Just, just a little example there. Boom! So, I mean, this must carry in. I mean, what you’re really talking about, you’re not separating leadership at work and at home and with your clients and partners, you’re really talking about being right within you, being connected to you, being loving to yourself right. In investing in you first, so that when you show up as you know, CEO of your company, when you show up with your clients or partners, or when you show up as mom or wife or sister, that you you’re giving from a place of overflowing.

Yes, yes, that’s right. It’s just a simple, kind of a model that I use. It’s this idea of belief determines behavior. And, I think we, as a society, think it’s so much easier to do behavior modification and this is how we parent, you know, and this is how we lead. Reviews. It’s all behavior modification, right? You’re not acting this way. We need you to change. But the problem is we can’t really truly change behavior until we change what the person believes underneath that behavior.

So, if we really get at the belief level, this is what I call generous leadership. And this idea of abundance that you mentioned is exactly the way that we, that I believe that leadership should be. It’s just coming from generous leadership is the ability to abundantly give of yourself so that others may be better people who do better work and it’s in that order.

So, who are you and what do you believe so that you can do the work that you were meant to do? And, we can’t give abundantly. We cannot lead generously if we don’t know who we are and we’re not in that place of freedom and rest. And so we have to do as leaders, the hard work of forming our own beliefs. And so if you go find a coach, who’s only focusing on your behavior, you’re not going to get very far, and you’re going to be telling your people that you just want behavior modification, you know, but if you’re going to work on the hard stuff and you show up and you’re like, man, I really suck at this area of my life. I’m not who I want to be right now. And, I’m tired, I’m complaining. But I really don’t think that I’m valuable in this area. I don’t think I have enough.

And you talk to your team that way and I’m working on. And I think we all can work on this together. It’s such a safe invitation and it elevates everybody and makes the space for excellence. I think women are really uniquely positioned to have these sorts of not just conversations, but you’re modeling. Because we’re so in touch, I think we can be more in touch with that head, heart connection than men. And we’re really brave when it comes to so going into places of authenticity. I think what we need to do is back that up a step and be brave first going in, you know, in, in our reflection time at home, in our closet time, you know, in our, like we’re going to go to the quiet space.

Kids can lock the door, stay inside and figure out who we are first to be brave there first. I think that maybe is the step that women leaders are missing, but we have high. I mean, we’re positioned and made for something like that. And that’s what you talk about a lot. I’ve listened to your podcast and that leading first, I think it’s so key. Yeah.

Otherwise I, I believe we’re in agreement. We might say it a little bit differently, but otherwise you’re just like in the coaching space, you’re just telling people what to do and it’s working, but then it doesn’t produce lasting change for them. They need to go on that journey themselves. So, you need to be the, I always think about shepherding someone.

Yes. Oh, I love that. I don’t, people don’t know like the, the metaphor of shepherds, you know, in their hooks that they carried. And that was because they would use that to go save a lamb that is falling, you know, into the bank, from the water, or isn’t a pit, they would pull it up and then shepherds would oftentimes, if the lamb was lame, they would swing it over the back of their neck and they would carry the lamb and the sheep grew to know the Shepherd’s voice. And so when other shepherds are in the field their sheep would come to them when they would call them.

And it’s this idea of a shepherding leader is this kind compassionate leader who is known and knows. And then the sheep want to, it’s the safe place, you know? And it’s not fluffy. You get more done and you’re more effective this way. People aren’t zombies who are disconnected and disengaged from work and bummed that they’re there and their families, if they’re bringing bad, toxic work home, their families are struggling. So, flip the coin and you’ve got fully human, fully engaged people showing up with their heart and mind.

One of the things I want to go back to that you were talking about is women being uniquely positioned because it’s already wired in us a little bit differently. I agree with that. I can just hear some people listening, going. Yeah, Tricia, Michelle, there’s no time in my day. It’s not possible for me. You know, you’re crazy. You’re just crazy. I can’t even find five minutes to comb my hair, you know, like that sort of thing.

And, I had this little light bulb go off in my head like, well, there’s the shine brightly side of our gifts. That’s, you know, and then there’s the dark side. And the dark side is our continuous, story that we’re not worthy and we’re not enough to allocate time for rest. That is kind of part of the story of, I don’t know, females in general, it feels like I could be wrong, but I’ll just say a lot of the women around me for sure. And, and myself included.

Yeah, I would agree. It’s I’m not enough. Or I don’t have enough time. I mean, I’ve been in that place. I’m sure you have. I don’t know. When I, when my kids were little, I felt like I couldn’t pee without their little fingers under the door. And so I think that their seasons, and so some seasons, it’s just all hands on deck. We’ve got little ones and the rest looks different then perhaps another season where they’re not that way.

Or even our businesses, they go and seasons and they’re cyclical and there’s valleys and there’s mountains and there’s everything in between. And so this ability to discern where you’re at and respond appropriately, like if I’m in a crazy, crazy, crazy season of the designing and building, and I have deadlines, rest is not me throwing it all away. So, I’m still getting the work done, but it looks different in that season. You said. Being okay with the little stuff of just taking the time to, have space for little to say, I’m enough, I’m good at em. I’m worthy enough to go get my nails done, or I’m going to go for a walk every day. My kids really don’t have to have me there in the mornings.

They can afford 20 minutes every morning. Cause I’m going to go walk and listen and be quiet and pray and whatever it is. I think so in generous leadership, I believe that it’s a paradigm and I believe there are three ways of seeing. And the first one is seeing yourself as valuable. You can’t be a generous leader until you see yourself as valuable. And I would then go to say, I bet you, most women listening are like, yeah, yeah. I see myself as valuable. Yeah, sure. Okay.

Look at some of the pictures and do the pictures reflect that you are. And I just say pictures as a metaphor, but do they reflect, when you look at the pictures of your life, do they reflect that you value yourself?

Right. Right. And you do the five whys game. Right. You know, of getting to the root cause of things. So, if you really think you’re valuable, then why don’t you start doing something like setting sleep patterns. You’re going to change your sleep pattern because I’m valuable and asked to get eight hours of sleep a night. And then if you’re not hitting and you’re not keeping that, then not? And then you go, why, why, why? And you get to that root of, Oh, I think that their time is worth more than my time.

I think that this is the most difficult part because I’ve had some real sobering types of experiences looking in the mirror at myself and getting really honest about what I’m saying versus how I’m showing up. And, you know, how I spend my time and money as a very good indicator of what I value and what I don’t. And that’s hard to look at because it’s sometimes feels a little bit easier to be like staying outside of you and pointing at all the things that aren’t right. And why you can’t get eight hours of sleep a night, for example. I mean, that’s big stuff.

Yeah. Yep. I would think if you struggle, bring someone with you who can help you, you know, accountability, go walk with somebody or tell a friend that you’re your husband, that you’re wanting to work on that eight hours of sleep. And then reflect every week and reflect with them. If it’s so hard to do on your own, then bring somebody who is a truth teller, compassionate truth teller in your life. Maybe it’s not your husband, maybe it’s well,

Yeah, that’s such a great point. And I want to just give you a shout out for even the seasons when you were talking about the seasons. I thought that was so good because, Hey, it’s not just this nice flat terrain of life. I mean, you know, it is crazy and, and you have to be adaptable to that, but the stronger you are inside of yourself, you know, the more you have a place to come from.

And then, I mean, and this is really tactical stuff here that people can take away, which I love and use because the accountability is the other thing. Again, it sounds so simple, but when you’re surrounding yourself with people who are not going to tell you what you want to hear, but tell you the truth about how you’re showing up, that’s going to help you make a shift so much more easily.

Yes. Hopefully. Or you’ll be that defense that we don’t want to be that person.

So, you were starting to talk about this, about Generous Leadership. So, talk about the three areas.

Yeah. So, we really hit that first one, it is valuable. Don’t skip it. Generous Leadership is a paradigm. Like I think I mentioned earlier, it’s not a style. You can’t go be that kind of leader by going to a bunch of conferences and reading books and having a checklist of things that you’re going to do right. For people or whatever, it feels very forced and breaks trust. Instead of builds trust, cause people are really great at sniffing out. Yes. Detectors. I mean, you’re not being who you really are. And so that’s a paradigm, it’s a way of seeing and believing and it’s made up of those three lenses.

So first seeing yourself as valuable, not worthless. And like I said, that sounds like a blanket statement. You’re like, yeah, I got that. I promise you, there are areas we never fully arrive.

And the cocky CEO that we may work with or whatever, or have worked with in the past. It could be that they’re coming across egotistical or arrogant because they don’t think that they’re enough, it’s in a certain way. So, it can manifest in different ways, whether it’s self-deprecation or arrogance or a justification, whatever. So that first lens is seeing yourself as valuable.

The second one is seeing people as people, instead of objects, again, you’re like, Oh, I totally do that. I don’t objectify anybody well really? Because anytime we think about somebody purely by their job description and we forget that they have a family and perhaps they’re bringing in some pretty tough stuff right now to their job, we have then objectified them. Or anytime we try to put a group of people, we try to classify or put people in a box.

We do this in society. We do this broad brush paint, you know, of people, it objectifies them. So, what does it look like to treat people as people who have dreams and fears and hopes and needs like I do, and to get to know those and to recognize that yeah, we’re different. We’re also really similar.

And then the third lens is seeing your work as sacred versus ordinary. And I use the word sacred very intentionally. Sacred means set apart for a unique and special purpose. And work, I think is everything that you do. It’s not just your job, it’s your parenting, it’s your neighboring, volunteering, whatever it is that you do, cleaning the toilets. It’s being able to see the work that you do with meaning and purpose set apart for a unique, special purpose, because people are impacted by it.

And because you are valuable. So, the third lens comes out of the first two, and that’s what brings meaning and purpose to your work and the things that you do. And so, as a leader I can say, I really am valuable, I’m worth it. I see you as a person and not an object, and I’m going to celebrate who you are and not be afraid of that, but actually, see you and empower you, and then I believe that everything I do in this job, the menial all the way to the big stuff actually has meaning and purpose and impacts far more and could impact far more than I realized. When a leader shows up from that belief, that is what enables them to abundantly, give of themselves so that others can be better people who do better work.

So, it seems to me that it is imperative for leaders to work on these three ways of seeing if they’re really going to be able to bring teams together and move people from point A to point B. That’s what leadership is A to B, you’re moving somebody from one to another or a group of people. If you’re able to do that in a way that makes them better when they get to be all of us better in the world better, then you have to see through these three lenses and that’s all personal work. And the cool thing about it is that when you start to see this way, I talked about this in before then others are invited to see that way too.

It’s a modeling style of leadership. So good. So good. How did you give us a lens before we wrap it up to how you came here? I mean, we heard part of your personal journey, but how did you eventually kind of land on these three aspects?

What’s funny is it came to me in Israel. So, it’s all part, my story is so intertwined with the work that I do. I coined, I own the intellectual property to copyright, to Generous Leadership. And I got that about seven years ago, and I knew that there was this concept of generous leadership and it wasn’t servant leadership. Because servant leadership is a bit more of a style and people, it doesn’t have to be, but it can be, and it’s become that, where people are trying to use it for their own advantage, you know, and I can be kind of manipulating.

And so, I knew there was something to it, but I knew it was a way of seeing and believing. So it’s just been in this evolution year over a year of teaching and watching people form and grow and applying what I’ve seen. And then bam hit that wall nearly died literally. And, sitting quiet, reflecting in my space of recovery, where it was like, wow, that it’s these three ways of seeing. And it became so clear. And ever since then, that’s been the framework that we’ve taught. It’s been almost three and a half years since I’ve been back from that sabbatical. And it’s been amazing to see how the framework is such a simple but powerful guide for people. It does. You don’t have to overthink it, but it’s not easy work. You have to actually have courage and be intentional.

It’s so powerful. I love it. I will make sure that we put a link for anybody who wants to go check it out in the show notes. And I just want to thank you for being on the show.

Thank you. I really had fun. Thank you, Michelle.

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Was that amazing or what? Please, please, please reach out and let me know what stood out for you in my conversation with Tricia, because that is by far, one of my favorite things about these conversations is hearing from you. Now, before we say goodbye for today, there’s a couple things I want to call your attention to.

First of all, you definitely need to head on over to generousleadership.org and sign yourself up for the challenge. If you missed it, it’s a paradigm, right? It’s three ways of seeing, it’s a framework and the three things are in case you missed it.

You are valuable. That’s basically the fact that you are amazing, beautiful, and not worthless.

People are people, right? Not objects, treat one another as human beings.

Your work is sacred, work being everything you do.

And the last thing I want to call your attention to is the somewhat of a process, or at least several steps that Tricia talked about that got her out of the striving really allowed her the opportunity of the deaths of part of herself.

So, before the rebirth, you probably caught that in the conversation.

So, one was the disruption that takes place in some way, shape or form. You know, she and I talked a lot about health concerns because we had that in common, but it could look and feel different for you, but some sort of disruption.

And then allowing herself as, you know, kind of step number two or progress point number two, to release control, moving into a place where she was surrendering.

The third and that one snuck in there really quickly cause she added it in and I almost missed it. She said also the point of not caring, really letting go of caring, what other people thought about her.

And then fourth moving into the recalibration of her values of your values, where you want to be in the future. Where are you going? Who do you want to become?

And then finally growing and working on growth in the area of self-awareness.

So, this, there was a lot in this conversation, a lot of really, really good stuff. So I encourage you to bookmark this one because I believe, I mean, I already know for myself, I’m gonna come back to this. And I do this often as relisten to the conversations that I’ve had with these women on the show. And, you know, you’ll hear something differently because there’s so much information, so much powerful information for your own self growth, your own self knowing, that I believe coming back to it will help you go to the next level. So, this is one of those I really do believe all of them are.

And I know I say that, but this is something to bookmark. And to come back to, I have no doubt. You will continue to find and uncover some really beautiful diamonds in this conversation. And finally, my ask of you before I say farewell is to take a moment and meaningfully share this conversation with someone that you know, who you believe might find it helpful. We’re not doing massive advertising here. We’re just looking to make a difference with women and awesome men, just like you and just like me. So your one minute to forward the link along to somebody that you know, who might find helpful could make a huge, huge difference for them.

And for me, I thank you so very much. And we will talk to you soon.